[Arm-netbook] OT: Food for thought

David Niklas doark at mail.com
Wed Jul 10 02:55:00 BST 2019

Hash: SHA256

According to claws-mail, this email was lost. If this is a resend then it
is also a re-write with a little additional material at the end. So,
reply to this one.

On Tue, 9 Jul 2019 00:00:06 -0400
zap <zapper at disroot.org> wrote:
> > Ah, here the story is:
> > https://web.archive.org/web/20150225094201/http://english.cw.com.tw/article.do?action=show&id=14895
> >
> > It seems to me that there will always be thieves in the world. Hiding
> > science does more harm to the scientific community then the
> > thieves.
> > Think long term though, luke, as chip fabrication plants are prone to
> > do, at least for process design and improvement. If I'm a priest and
> > I'll give away copies of the Bible and your a chip fabrication guru
> > and you don't ever tell anyone anything about chip fabrication what
> > will the population learn about?! Isn't it obvious that science will
> > ultimately die off or become some super diluted idiocy (old wives
> > tales)?! If people are willing to die for God(s) (real or not), but
> > not even lift a finger, but instead purposefully restrict knowledge
> > and understanding, to teach their fellow man the sciences will the
> > sciences not be out competed many to one?! Am I the only one who sees
> > this (our/your/the chip fabs), fate?  
> To be honest, I don't really understand why more people don't support
> freedom of knowledge more, one of the basic beliefs of serving God was
> supposed to be freedom to be the best you, you can be. Yet at the same
> time, there are people out there who *claim to believe in god* who
> think excercising freedom means hoarding knowledge or rights for
> yourself only and restricting others. The irony of that is that you
> cannot serve both money or God. Another irony though is that sharing is
> universally a good thing and in many ways is Godly.  As long as it
> isn't about sharing people... aka romance...
> I also believe though we need to take better care of our world. Stupid
> people who don't believe in any form of science or believe in psuedo
> science(s) should not be our rulers, etc... Extremism, as always is the
> main issue of life. People like to be all or nothing a lot, but I
> believe that all or nothing thinking leads to calamities. There is a
> lot of gray out there. Some darker, some lighter. Emulation is a
> perfect example of this, as companies genuinely seem to want to make
> you have to pay for multiple copies of the same thing if one breaks.
> This is complete bs, digital restrictions management and all rights
> reserved licenses will always be the wrong method due to the issue of
> not being allowed to modify or share or reveal what is in it.
> PS, I don't believe science and God disprove each other. There can be
> unfamothable parallels.
> Many paths, many sorrows, one hope only.

I was contrasting the spread of religion with science to make a point,
not that the are mutually exclusive. For if God created the world, which
works on scientific principles, can God be against science?

> > I digress, this cannot be my life. It's fundamentally not for me. I'm
> > a fool for wanting to learn -- anything. I'm wedded to suicide. I'd be
> > equally productive considering the long term, in watching the clouds
> > go by. I'm going to do things differently... much, much differently,
> > if I have any say so at all in the matter!  
> As for this, suicide is not the answer.  IF someone is truly evil on a
> nazi level, I think its less bad, but still bad nonetheless.
> I wish you the best on finding hope in life. That being said, evil is
> very hard to avoid in our pit of a world.
> PS, anyone reading this may agree to disagree if they choose. I don't
> want to force people to be a certain way. Everyone has a path to carve,
> choose wisely.

I did not mean to indicate that suicide was the answer. I was trying to
say that a system that kills itself is suicidal and that in as much as I
participate in it then I too will be killing my field and aught to be in
My hope is in doing things differently in keeping with the obvious
words of Christ: "Neither do men light a candle (the candle of science),
and put it under a bushel, but upon a candlestick, that it may give light
to all that are in the house." -- Douay Rheims

Chip fabs depend on smart well educated people to operate and design
them. If they wall off the knowledge as to how they work the brains of the
smart people will either take interest in another field, atrophy, or
arrive at the plants will little knowledge of what to do or how they work.
I've tried to find books on the subject. Look at the current material
like "Silicon Processing For The Vlsi Era":

These are ebay used books:
$4.57 293115019126 Volume 1: Process Technology
$5.60 143211754813 Volume 2: Process Integration (ExLib)
$6.08 143179464527 Volume 3: The Submicron MOSFET

And finally on amazon used books:
$499.51 ISBN: 978-0961672171 Volume 4: Deep-Submicron Process Technology

That price for a book of 822 pages *used* is HUGE!!!! I can get a
*new* book with ~2x as many pages for $130, namely, my Bible.

Read the comments (highlights mine):
"This book provides a great amount of information on a field where there
isn't much information to be found.[SIC] It is easy to read and very
descriptive - highly recommended.

It is a 2002[SIC] book though, talking about a field which evolves too
quickly. Some of the "future" things the book talks about have already
happened or the industry decided to move in a different direction, but in
general this is not much a problem.[Unless you want to learn how to do


"This well written reference book is highly recommended to anyone
interested in the technology used to manufacture deep-submicron MOSFETs,
i.e., MOSFETs requiring lithography in the 1/4 to 1/8-micron[SIC]
range. ..."

1/8th of a micron is 125nm! 125nm! We're at 7nm, with 6nm risk
production IIRC, and 5nm is in an alpha state!


Feel free to ask for clarification if needed. I'll try again. I'm not mad
at you, at them, rather like Faust, I suffer from "care". And a bad case
of it at that.



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