[Arm-netbook] arm-netbook Digest, Vol 76, Issue 18

Mon Nov 28 16:44:45 GMT 2016

On 11/28/2016 03:17 AM, arm-netbook-request at lists.phcomp.co.uk wrote:
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> Today's Topics:
>
>    1. Re: arm-netbook Digest, Vol 76, Issue 17 (zap)
>    2. Re: arm-netbook Digest, Vol 76, Issue 17
>       (Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton)
>    3. OT: The U.S. Needs to Stop Lecturing the Rest of the World
>       About Internet Values (Alexander Ross)
>    4. Re: OT: The U.S. Needs to Stop Lecturing the Rest of the
>       World About Internet Values (Jonathan Frederickson)
>    5. Re: OT: The U.S. Needs to Stop Lecturing the Rest of the
>       World About Internet Values (Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton)
>    6. Re: OT: The U.S. Needs to Stop Lecturing the Rest of the
>       World About Internet Values (FaTony)
>    7. Re: OT: The U.S. Needs to Stop Lecturing the Rest of the
>       World About Internet Values (Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Sun, 27 Nov 2016 18:05:05 -0500
> From: zap <calmstorm at openmailbox.org>
> To: arm-netbook at lists.phcomp.co.uk
> Subject: Re: [Arm-netbook] arm-netbook Digest, Vol 76, Issue 17
> Message-ID: <583B66A1.8070200 at openmailbox.org>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
>
> On 11/27/2016 02:00 PM, arm-netbook-request at lists.phcomp.co.uk wrote:
>> Send arm-netbook mailing list submissions to
>> 	arm-netbook at lists.phcomp.co.uk
>>
>> To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit
>> 	http://lists.phcomp.co.uk/mailman/listinfo/arm-netbook
>> or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to
>> 	arm-netbook-request at lists.phcomp.co.uk
>>
>> You can reach the person managing the list at
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>>
>> When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific
>> than "Re: Contents of arm-netbook digest..."
>>
>>
>> Today's Topics:
>>
>>    1. A few questions, (zap)
>>    2. Re: A few questions, (Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton)
>>
>>
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 1
>> Date: Sat, 26 Nov 2016 14:33:23 -0500
>> From: zap <calmstorm at openmailbox.org>
>> To: arm-netbook at lists.phcomp.co.uk
>> Subject: [Arm-netbook] A few questions,
>> Message-ID: <5839E383.80201 at openmailbox.org>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
>>
>> Correct me if i am wrong, but you said in your latest update that 4
>> gigabytes of ram may be a possibility in the future yes?
>>
>> Or am I misunderstanding?
>>
>> The other question though I wondered was it says on some of your
>> delivery dates march or something like that,
>>
>> I just wondered how long it takes from the time I order for the day it
>> would arrive,
>>
>> also, when exactly is the printed for you, instructions/videos coming out of curiosity?
>>
>> for the record I didn´t know you had a mailing list for the longest time.
>>
>> but thanks for telling me.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Message: 2
>> Date: Sat, 26 Nov 2016 19:45:41 +0000
>> From: Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton <lkcl at lkcl.net>
>> To: Linux on small ARM machines <arm-netbook at lists.phcomp.co.uk>
>> Subject: Re: [Arm-netbook] A few questions,
>> Message-ID:
>> 	<CAPweEDwiTdngDMR0Tupuv35WSRsQ6ZM=ALNX9-eUJAn0J__Jxg at mail.gmail.com>
>> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
>>
>> hiya zap welcome to the list: thanks for agreeing to post this publicly.
>>
>>
>> On Sat, Nov 26, 2016 at 7:33 PM, zap <calmstorm at openmailbox.org> wrote:
>>> Correct me if i am wrong, but you said in your latest update that 4
>>> gigabytes of ram may be a possibility in the future yes?
>>  on the RK3288 board only, yes.  most ARM SoCs are hard-limited to a
>> maximum of 2GB external DDR addressing: the RK3288 is literally the
>> only one i've found so far that can even do 4GB.  reason: it was
>> designed as a medium-level chromebook processor.
>>
>>  to clarify and make absolutely clear: you will NEVER get an A20 SoC with above 2GB of RAM.
>
> If that's the case, I guess I can safely assume that 4gb is in the
> future maybe for a different processor but not the near future and not
> for the current a20 processor.
>
>
>
>>> The other question though I wondered was it says on some of your
>>> delivery dates march or something like that,
>>>
>>> I just wondered how long it takes from the time I order for the day it
>>> would arrive,
>>  i honestly cannot say.  i did the best i could estimate however
>> within even just a couple of weeks of the campaign ending i reached
>> out to an associate to confirm the previous arrangement of staying in
>> taiwan to help him out (and save costs)... and his arrangements had
>> changed.
>>
>>  so really, best thing: keep an eye on the updates, and just go with it :)
> Okay I already have been as you can guess by my interest.
>
>
>
>
>>> also, when exactly is the printed for you, instructions/videos coming out of curiosity?
>>  when i'm making up the 12-or-so for the individuals that pledged for
>> fully-assembled ones.  in other words i have 12 opportunities to make
>> the videos :)
>>
>>  however as this is a libre project, i already started some basic
>> instructions if you want to get stuck in early - just bear in mind i
>> need to bring the CAD python source up-to-date relative to the current
>> PCB changes.  so you'll be printing stuff out that will *not* fit the
>> current PCBs and components okay?  however you will not need to throw
>> all of the parts out, just re-print a few of them.
>>
>>  https://www.youmagine.com/designs/libre-hardware-licensed-parametric-laptop-design
>
>
>
>>> for the record I didn´t know you had a mailing list for the longest time.
>>  i would say "it's right there on the page" but i actually had to
>> search for it myself (and it's a looong page).  yeah this is a
>> long-running project.
> Okay my bad.
>
>
>
>> l.
>>
>>
>>
>> ------------------------------
>>
>> Subject: Digest Footer
>>
>> _______________________________________________
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>> ------------------------------
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>> End of arm-netbook Digest, Vol 76, Issue 17
>> *******************************************
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Mon, 28 Nov 2016 00:12:12 +0000
> From: Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton <lkcl at lkcl.net>
> To: Linux on small ARM machines <arm-netbook at lists.phcomp.co.uk>
> Subject: Re: [Arm-netbook] arm-netbook Digest, Vol 76, Issue 17
> Message-ID:
> 	<CAPweEDwpLBXxbzc5vcf0BqnpmvpiM7CFp1z4nLPBt5BEvrKjDQ at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
>
> ah, just some rules (which are common practice and have been well
> established for over two decades) when subscribing in digest mode: cut
> the context, otherwise you force everbody (over 600 people in this
> instance) to trawl through extraneous stuff that they've already read,
> looking for the few percentage points on a line-by-line basis for what
> you've written.
>
> an example of doing that is demonstrated below.  which i was forced to
> do, myself, as you didn't do it.
>
>
>>>  to clarify and make absolutely clear: you will NEVER get an A20 SoC with above 2GB of RAM.
>>
>> If that's the case, I guess I can safely assume that 4gb is in the
>> future maybe for a different processor but not the near future and not
>> for the current a20 processor.
>  yes.  that's why the update said specifically "4GB is planned for the
> RK3288" and no other processor.  if there existed any other processor
> capable of doing 4GB of RAM i would specifically have mentioned it.
>
>  even the latest intel tablet-targetted SoCs (the ones that have now
> been terminated because nobody buys them because they're shit) have
> two variants: one which maxes out at 2GB RAM and one which maxes out
> at 8GB.

Oh on another interesting note btw, not that you will be doing this in
the near future, but I read on trisquel forums that I guess I am not the
only one who wants, another size option.

such as 11, 10 or 7.

My preference is between 10-13 inches.

But I just wanted to make sure you knew that I wasn't the only one.

Although, I had a thought, at some point maybe make a poll to see how
many people want a smaller size and who would be willing to buy one.

THIS is a THOUGHT, I just wanted to put out there.  Feel free to deny my
request if you don't have the time at the moment, but whenever you can
find time, it would be a good idea.

>>>> for the record I didn´t know you had a mailing list for the longest time.
>>>  i would say "it's right there on the page" but i actually had to
>>> search for it myself (and it's a looong page).  yeah this is a
>>> long-running project.
>> Okay my bad.
>  nono - there's been so much going on it's easy to miss things.
>
> l.
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Mon, 28 Nov 2016 01:27:00 +0000
> From: Alexander Ross <maillist_arm-netbook at aross.me>
> To: Linux on small ARM machines <arm-netbook at lists.phcomp.co.uk>
> Subject: [Arm-netbook] OT: The U.S. Needs to Stop Lecturing the Rest
> 	of the World About Internet Values
> Message-ID: <dbb6066b-dcff-c3db-c113-628d33c24485 at aross.me>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
>
> off topic:
>
> I’m finding this insightful as to why luke was treated the way he was by
> a number of allwinner :( people:
>
> http://www.slate.com/articles/technology/future_tense/2016/11/the_u_s_should_stop_lecturing_about_internet_values.html
>
> bit in particular i just read:
>
> "
> Just as one man’s freedom fighter is another man’s terrorist, one
> country’s “soft power” is another’s weaponized values and existential
> threat. Because Americans see their values and interests as essentially
> benign, they completely miss how those abroad interpret what seem like
> harmless acts. (The Chinese and the Russians read Soft Power: The Means
> to Success in World Politics, too, and they’re on to you.) Furthermore,
> much of the Chinese and Russian political class believe the West’s
> insistence on democracy and human rights is not merely distasteful and
> unnecessary, but a concerted way to weaken and destabilize them. As it
> is, Chinese Communist Party cadres are instructed by party bosses to be
> vigilant against “American efforts to overthrow the communist system
> through ‘peaceful evolution’—that is, the spread of Western ideas and
> culture.” Now imagine what the turbo-freedom of America’s global
> internet looks like to them.
>
> Actually, you don’t have to imagine it. In 2011, two years after
> President Obama’s town hall meeting with future Chinese leaders in
> Shanghai, the state-run newspaper China People’s Daily editorialized
> about the United States’ deployment of shadow networks in authoritarian
> countries: “The US State Department has carefully framed its support of
> such projects as promoting free speech and human rights, but it is clear
> that the policy is aimed at destabilizing national governments.” It
> called Tor—software that helps people mask their location—“a weapon in a
> covert cyber war intended to maintain the US’ global dominance.”
> "
>
> LOL teaching to population that the tool that helps them is in fact the
> enemy, classic. the us funded tor cus a sub department needed such a
> tool too. while other departments hate it :)
>
> ...but yes the powers that be speak BS about freedom,etc when they them
> selfs are promoting the surveillance - the never forget state. it will
> be logged, it will be jugged. the citizens will be given a treat level
> to the state and status quo rating. or some other named way of
> categorisation.
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Sun, 27 Nov 2016 20:46:46 -0500
> From: Jonathan Frederickson <silverskullpsu at gmail.com>
> To: Linux on small ARM machines <arm-netbook at lists.phcomp.co.uk>
> Subject: Re: [Arm-netbook] OT: The U.S. Needs to Stop Lecturing the
> 	Rest of the World About Internet Values
> Message-ID:
> 	<CAAyzKeNMG01a-LQLXV_6boSpzrhY6oJci8Yh5naEbHhAtQc8hw at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
>
>>> Actually, you don’t have to imagine it. In 2011, two years after
>>> President Obama’s town hall meeting with future Chinese leaders in
>>> Shanghai, the state-run newspaper China People’s Daily editorialized
>>> about the United States’ deployment of shadow networks in authoritarian
>>> countries: “The US State Department has carefully framed its support of
>>> such projects as promoting free speech and human rights, but it is clear
>>> that the policy is aimed at destabilizing national governments.” It
>>> called Tor—software that helps people mask their location—“a weapon in a
>>> covert cyber war intended to maintain the US’ global dominance.”
>>> "
>> LOL teaching to population that the tool that helps them is in fact the
>> enemy, classic. the us funded tor cus a sub department needed such a
>> tool too. while other departments hate it :)
> Yeah. I think this speaks to just how hard it is to see different
> perspectives, even on the internet where there are (in theory) no
> borders. As a US citizen it's clear to me that politicians here are
> wary of privacy-preserving technologies like Tor. (And PGP and OTR -
> hello crypto wars!) Overseas maybe that's less apparent.
>
> Of course this could all be the result of complex plots within the US
> government and foreign governments, but I tend to believe that it's
> more just a lack of exposure to different cultural values.
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Mon, 28 Nov 2016 02:12:03 +0000
> From: Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton <lkcl at lkcl.net>
> To: Linux on small ARM machines <arm-netbook at lists.phcomp.co.uk>
> Subject: Re: [Arm-netbook] OT: The U.S. Needs to Stop Lecturing the
> 	Rest of the World About Internet Values
> Message-ID:
> 	<CAPweEDxhHJ-reaOmCnjmq_a_LLEATfS5=cffiFMrCf_Qq5FkRQ at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
>
> ---
> crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68
>
>
> On Mon, Nov 28, 2016 at 1:46 AM, Jonathan Frederickson
> <silverskullpsu at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Of course this could all be the result of complex plots within the US
>> government and foreign governments, but I tend to believe that it's
>> more just a lack of exposure to different cultural values.
>  very much so, i feel.  in essence: no one size fits all, and now we
> see even emerging countries are beginning to wake up to the massive
> over-reach and destruction of sovereignty that the U.S. has been
> undertaking for decades.  the key point of the fascinating and rather
> long article [1] is that various small countries are viewing U.S.
> diplomatic and political efforts finally for what it is: extremist
> imperialist domination.  unfortunately they're not the only country
> that's historically manipulated entire [small] countries, but the
> point is we kiiinda expect it to *be* history... not still happening
> *right now*.
>
>  now, i'm not one for just "complaining": there's enough of that crap
> going on already.  i very much like to also suggest actual solutions,
> and in this instance there happens to be a perfect fit: look up
> someone called "robert david steele".  there's an extremely good
> article about him in 2014 by the guardian [2].  he started the "open
> source intelligence" movement.  a quote:
>
> Today’s capitalism, he argues, is inherently predatory and destructive:
>
> “Over the course of the last centuries, the commons was fenced, and
> everything from agriculture to water was commoditised without regard
> to the true cost in non-renewable resources. Human beings, who had
> spent centuries evolving away from slavery, were re-commoditised by
> the Industrial Era.”
>
> huh.  how about that.  someone else who recognises that "employment"
> is nothing more than a rebadged, re-introduced form of slavery.  don't
> believe me?  if you're a software engineer actually READ your
> employment contract.  paying particular attention to the intelligence
> enslavement clauses.  the ones that say that your employer owns
> absolutely everything that you do, think and say.  if it wasn't
> enslavement, you would be REWARDED in direct proportion to the value
> of the work that you provide.  you don't: you get paid a quotes fair
> wage quotes.  fuck off if you actually want *shock horror* shares in
> the company!
>
> yyeah....
>
> holy fuck i had no idea:  "the west supports 42 of 44 [world] dictators".
>
>
> [1] http://m.journal-neo.org/2016/11/09/philippines-triggers-asian-tectonic-shift-away-from-us/
> [2] https://www.theguardian.com/environment/earth-insight/2014/jun/19/open-source-revolution-conquer-one-percent-cia-spy
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Mon, 28 Nov 2016 03:51:00 +0000
> From: FaTony <fatony at fatony.net>
> To: Linux on small ARM machines <arm-netbook at lists.phcomp.co.uk>
> Subject: Re: [Arm-netbook] OT: The U.S. Needs to Stop Lecturing the
> 	Rest of the World About Internet Values
> Message-ID: <e4ba7c0a-1775-777f-26c3-a00c0e2bdca5 at fatony.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
>> Furthermore,
>> much of the Chinese and Russian political class believe the West’s
>> insistence on democracy and human rights is not merely distasteful and
>> unnecessary, but a concerted way to weaken and destabilize them.
> Here's a view from inside of Russia. Russian TV is full of anti-west
> propaganda. Every day I hear ppl discussing how some bad stuff is
> happening in US, Europe or Ukraine and how Russian patriotism and
> Orthodox Church are the foundation upon which you should live.
>
> But it is forbidden to talk about Russian issues. Anyone who dares gets
> sued, arrested, tortured or killed. Russian authorities use a blacklist
> of sites and do DPI to make sure that nobody will find a way to
> opposition sites that bring up Russian issues. They also have the legal
> capacity to store all internet traffic for 6 months.
>
> Nowadays, about 90% of my traffic goes through Tor or VPN because
> there's simply no other way to get information.
>
> But most people don't care about these issues, they are simply trying to
> survive and not die of starvation. There is no hope in fixing this from
> the inside, Russia as a country has no future. NATO should invade and
> grab all the western territories while China will surely grab Siberia.
>
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> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 7
> Date: Mon, 28 Nov 2016 08:17:07 +0000
> From: Luke Kenneth Casson Leighton <lkcl at lkcl.net>
> To: Linux on small ARM machines <arm-netbook at lists.phcomp.co.uk>
> Subject: Re: [Arm-netbook] OT: The U.S. Needs to Stop Lecturing the
> 	Rest of the World About Internet Values
> Message-ID:
> 	<CAPweEDzO5n0=zQ3E0bwFHR4aDLsS7C8xAmaG1-1s5jj6Jk_aoQ at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8
>
> ---
> crowd-funded eco-conscious hardware: https://www.crowdsupply.com/eoma68
>
>
> On Mon, Nov 28, 2016 at 3:51 AM, FaTony <fatony at fatony.net> wrote:
>
>> But most people don't care about these issues, they are simply trying to
>> survive and not die of starvation. There is no hope in fixing this from
>> the inside, Russia as a country has no future. NATO should invade and
>> grab all the western territories while China will surely grab Siberia.
>  you have to have hope, man.  i had no idea things were that bad, it
> would seem thet russia's feeling the effects of what robert david
> steele describes as being an endemic and systemic power-corruption,
> just as much as anywhere.
>
>  he does however point out that the "poor" have, collectively, *MORE*
> buying-power than the 1% elite who keep them oppressed and suppressed.
> do read what he wrote because i feel that you will see that there is
> always hope.
>
> l.
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
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> ------------------------------
>
> End of arm-netbook Digest, Vol 76, Issue 18
> *******************************************